Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Thu May 31, 2012 12:36 pm

Freckles wrote:Tamta-
IIRC, didn't the LE speak at length to one of her MH friends?
Was Sierra not going to loan some clothing to another girl from MH?
(I wondered if the shirt in the purse was that item.)

It has been recently revealed through the SOF that Sierra's last text allegedly sent to a MH student and was about sharing cosmetics and homework.

The cosmetics were not listed as being found in her hand bag.

I don't know if Marlene contacted this girl.

I believe this person was one of the first two kids interviewed by LE and/FBI
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Thu May 31, 2012 12:38 pm

Freckles wrote:
Tamta wrote:
Freckles wrote:Did Marlene attempt to call Sierra that afternoon?
If so, I apologize as I had not heard that.
I understood, from her, the last contact was that AM--- about 6 AM.

Marlene reported I think 3 attempts to text Sierra at 345pm when she left work to come home.

Time to pull over.
I am asleep at the wheel here.


There was another report about Marlene driving to the school after having left work early because of being concerned but that may be a rumor.
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Re: Sierra LaMar Missing 03/16/12

Post by Typo Positive on Thu May 31, 2012 12:38 pm

Freckles wrote:Tamta-
IIRC, didn't the LE speak at length to one of her MH friends?
Was Sierra not going to loan some clothing to another girl from MH?
(I wondered if the shirt in the purse was that item.)

This appears to be entirely speculative about the loaning of
clothes. It has not been established who these close friends
she would have done so were.
It is considered her Fremont friends of long standing were her
closest friends. She was living with her Dad. He openly disputed
the notion she packed clothes to take to school to exchange with friends. So if she didn't do so in Fremont with old friends, why
would she with kids she didn't know that well yet?

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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Thu May 31, 2012 12:42 pm

Typo Positive wrote:
Freckles wrote:Tamta-
IIRC, didn't the LE speak at length to one of her MH friends?
Was Sierra not going to loan some clothing to another girl from MH?
(I wondered if the shirt in the purse was that item.)

This appears to be entirely speculative about the loaning of
clothes. It has not been established who these close friends
she would have done so were.
It is considered her Fremont friends of long standing were her
closest friends. She was living with her Dad. He openly disputed
the notion she packed clothes to take to school to exchange with friends. So if she didn't do so in Fremont with old friends, why
would she with kids she didn't know that well yet?

According to her Dad it was not typical for her to pack her bag in that way and even in that same interview Marlene seemed to question it, although later in NG alluded to it being normal.

The docs say the text was about make up and work.
We infer it was a girl.
We infer ability and intent to go to school.
We do not see cosmetics or shoes as listed as items recovered.
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Re: Sierra LaMar Missing 03/16/12

Post by Typo Positive on Thu May 31, 2012 12:47 pm

Tamta wrote:
Freckles wrote:
Tamta wrote:
Freckles wrote:Did Marlene attempt to call Sierra that afternoon?
If so, I apologize as I had not heard that.
I understood, from her, the last contact was that AM--- about 6 AM.

Marlene reported I think 3 attempts to text Sierra at 345pm when she left work to come home.

Time to pull over.
I am asleep at the wheel here.


There was another report about Marlene driving to the school after having left work early because of being concerned but that may be a rumor.

It was widely reported in the media that Marlene claimed to drive to the school to see if she just missed the bus as soon as she got the e-mail.

After 6pm and no contact and it just dawns on her to think she missed the bus?
Like the school would not have contacted her sooner if that were the case.

It is the unevenness of the apparent alarm we are supposed to believe.
She tells us much later that she knew immediately she must have been kidnapped.
I juxtapose that with the dinner on time and no search along her bus route or school prior.

Yet, whatever, wherever she was when 911 was contacted.
The POLICE were immediately suspicious.
hmmm.


Last edited by Typo Positive on Thu May 31, 2012 12:51 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : to add.)

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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Honeysage on Thu May 31, 2012 12:51 pm

Tamta wrote:
Freckles wrote:
Tamta wrote:
Freckles wrote:Did Marlene attempt to call Sierra that afternoon?
If so, I apologize as I had not heard that.
I understood, from her, the last contact was that AM--- about 6 AM.

Marlene reported I think 3 attempts to text Sierra at 345pm when she left work to come home.

Time to pull over.
I am asleep at the wheel here.


There was another report about Marlene driving to the school after having left work early because of being concerned but that may be a rumor.

i don't think she left work early...it was on NG. she said she attempted to text at 3:45 before leaving for work which was typical for her (you know-like the lunch money). with all these "it was just a typical day" scenarios it really does boggle the mind why Marlene did not go into freak out mode when Sierra was not answering her phone, it was going to voice mail, she was not home, a friend told her she was not at school and yet to not panic until you get school confirmation email?? how many warning signs do you need? and the driving to school never made sense to me-did she just drive around parking lot? i mean...wouldn't you physically go into the school office to ask about Sierra?
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Thu May 31, 2012 12:54 pm

Honeysage wrote:
Tamta wrote:
Freckles wrote:
Tamta wrote:
Freckles wrote:Did Marlene attempt to call Sierra that afternoon?
If so, I apologize as I had not heard that.
I understood, from her, the last contact was that AM--- about 6 AM.

Marlene reported I think 3 attempts to text Sierra at 345pm when she left work to come home.

Time to pull over.
I am asleep at the wheel here.


There was another report about Marlene driving to the school after having left work early because of being concerned but that may be a rumor.

i don't think she left work early...it was on NG. she said she attempted to text at 3:45 before leaving for work which was typical for her (you know-like the lunch money). with all these "it was just a typical day" scenarios it really does boggle the mind why Marlene did not go into freak out mode when Sierra was not answering her phone, it was going to voice mail, she was not home, a friend told her she was not at school and yet to not panic until you get school confirmation email?? how many warning signs do you need? and the driving to school never made sense to me-did she just drive around parking lot? i mean...wouldn't you physically go into the school office to ask about Sierra?

I would or I would have my ex or bf over there directly while I called 911 pronto.
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Stolat on Thu May 31, 2012 12:57 pm

Honeysage wrote:
Tamta wrote:
Freckles wrote:
Tamta wrote:
Freckles wrote:Did Marlene attempt to call Sierra that afternoon?
If so, I apologize as I had not heard that.
I understood, from her, the last contact was that AM--- about 6 AM.

Marlene reported I think 3 attempts to text Sierra at 345pm when she left work to come home.

Time to pull over.
I am asleep at the wheel here.


There was another report about Marlene driving to the school after having left work early because of being concerned but that may be a rumor.

i don't think she left work early...it was on NG. she said she attempted to text at 3:45 before leaving for work which was typical for her (you know-like the lunch money). with all these "it was just a typical day" scenarios it really does boggle the mind why Marlene did not go into freak out mode when Sierra was not answering her phone, it was going to voice mail, she was not home, a friend told her she was not at school and yet to not panic until you get school confirmation email?? how many warning signs do you need? and the driving to school never made sense to me-did she just drive around parking lot? i mean...wouldn't you physically go into the school office to ask about Sierra?

Freckles - sadly, I think there just are some parents out there that don't think and react like we do -- the mere fact that we're *here* on RC sorta shows some concern for children in general. I would have thought Tracy Martin would have gone into freak mode when he didn't hear from his son Trayvon Martin all night, but he claims he just assumed he was with some friends. And Tracy had nothing to do with TM's murder. So my point is, there just are some parents whos red flags are just not operating at the same trigger rate as the rest of us.
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Re: Sierra LaMar Missing 03/16/12

Post by Typo Positive on Thu May 31, 2012 1:00 pm

She has spoken of 3:45 texts.
Then 6pm e-mail from school.
Have we heard what Marlene was doing in between
is what I was asking in my convoluted fashion!

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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Thu May 31, 2012 1:03 pm

Typo Positive wrote:She has spoken of 3:45 texts.
Then 6pm e-mail from school.
Have we heard what Marlene was doing in between
is what I was asking in my convoluted fashion!

I had inferred that Marlene left work around the 345-400pm hour and
then had a long commute back from San Jose area, right?

Maybe almost 1.5-2 hours with traffic?

After getting home it appears that she recieved the 600pm school email and then
made some calls?

Somewhere by 630 or thereafter calls LE
or 911?

The thing is is that ML never directly said what time she left that day but answered to the effect of: "I usually leave"
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Stolat on Thu May 31, 2012 1:09 pm

Typo Positive wrote:It was widely reported in the media that Marlene claimed to drive to the school to see if she just missed the bus as soon as she got the e-mail.

After 6pm and no contact and it just dawns on her to think she missed the bus?
Like the school would not have contacted her sooner if that were the case.

It is the unevenness of the apparent alarm we are supposed to believe.
She tells us much later that she knew immediately she must have been kidnapped.
I juxtapose that with the dinner on time and no search along her bus route or school prior.

Yet, whatever, wherever she was when 911 was contacted.
The POLICE were immediately suspicious.hmmm.

I would hope police would be immediately suspicous. She had an RSO father and sevearl RSO's living in the immediate area. I would want them all fired if they had access to that info and were *not* immediately suspicious. Send them off with the other keystone cops if that were the case. ... Even if Dad later was cleared, they wouldn't have that info to do so right up front so the normal reaction is to be alarmed.
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Thu May 31, 2012 1:13 pm

Stolat wrote:
Typo Positive wrote:It was widely reported in the media that Marlene claimed to drive to the school to see if she just missed the bus as soon as she got the e-mail.

After 6pm and no contact and it just dawns on her to think she missed the bus?
Like the school would not have contacted her sooner if that were the case.

It is the unevenness of the apparent alarm we are supposed to believe.
She tells us much later that she knew immediately she must have been kidnapped.
I juxtapose that with the dinner on time and no search along her bus route or school prior.

Yet, whatever, wherever she was when 911 was contacted.
The POLICE were immediately suspicious.hmmm.

I would hope police would be immediately suspicous. She had an RSO father and sevearl RSO's living in the immediate area. I would want them all fired if they had access to that info and were *not* immediately suspicious. Send them off with the other keystone cops if that were the case. ... Even if Dad later was cleared, they wouldn't have that info to do so right up front so the normal reaction is to be alarmed.

I am sure.
From what we know there were no visible signs of struggle or breaking and entering, plus stranger abductions are rare, so the family has to be put on the top of the list for scrutiny.
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Thu May 31, 2012 2:10 pm

Garcia-Torres set to enter plea in Sierra LaMar case

Snippped
BBM

A probable cause statement from the sheriff's office that was released by the district attorney's office last week provided more details about the morning of Sierra's disappearance.


Ok. Here this is again.
Was this what we saw, The Statement of Facts?
The media has repeatedly taken quotes from what they are referring to as the SOPC and that appear identical as to what was released as the SOF.


http://wap.ktvu.com/site.htm?targetUrl=http://www.ktvu.com/news/news/crime-law/garcia-torres-set-enter-plea-sierra-lamar-case/nPH2D/
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Julie on Thu May 31, 2012 3:43 pm

Please take the time to read the Reality Chatter Rules.

http://www.realitychatter.com/t9-rules#11

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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Honeysage on Thu May 31, 2012 3:52 pm

is there a time for the arraignment today? any news following? can't find a thing-sure do miss Hotsteno...
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Thu May 31, 2012 3:55 pm

Honeysage wrote:is there a time for the arraignment today? any news following? can't find a thing-sure do miss Hotsteno...

130pm
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Snaz on Thu May 31, 2012 4:10 pm

Thank you for getting this thread back into "non attack" mode. I know it's sometimes difficult when we are so passionate about our feelings, but it is critical we be respectful of other people's opinions and feelings.

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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Snaz on Thu May 31, 2012 4:24 pm

LAST WARNING:

Please be respectful to your fellow members. Personal attacks are strictly prohibited!

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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Julie on Thu May 31, 2012 4:42 pm

Bumping

Snaz wrote:LAST WARNING:

Please be respectful to your fellow members. Personal attacks are strictly prohibited!

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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Stolat on Thu May 31, 2012 4:46 pm

Tamta wrote:
Stolat wrote:
Tamta - what time is the arraignement? any live feed? I missed earlier if was already posted.

It's 130pm and I believe in the same basement court room as the initial arraignment so around 2pm+ we may start hearing something in the media.

There was no coverage from within previously.

I'll check if there is a PC planned

Oh yes... the dungeon. I remember. We speculated that there may be very little wireless coverage there.

Thanks for checkin. Oh, and hey! thanks for posting the informational article on DNA stats -- that was a good read!
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Thu May 31, 2012 4:47 pm

http://wap.ktvu.com/site.htm?targetUrl=http://www.ktvu.com/news/news/crime-law/garcia-torres-set-enter-plea-sierra-lamar-case/nPH2D/

I am reposting this link from ktvu which has at top and center a live stream link which may feature a reporter at the Courthouse after the arraignment.

I see nothing on the web referring to any plans for a PC from the DA or SO at the moment.

Sorry I don't have more!
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Thu May 31, 2012 4:48 pm

Stolat wrote:
Tamta wrote:
Stolat wrote:
Tamta - what time is the arraignement? any live feed? I missed earlier if was already posted.

It's 130pm and I believe in the same basement court room as the initial arraignment so around 2pm+ we may start hearing something in the media.

There was no coverage from within previously.

I'll check if there is a PC planned

Oh yes... the dungeon. I remember. We speculated that there may be very little wireless coverage there.

Thanks for checkin. Oh, and hey! thanks for posting the informational article on DNA stats -- that was a good read!

Welcome..

It was my personal fave and I learned a lot!!

It made me think of you too.

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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Honeysage on Thu May 31, 2012 5:22 pm

http://twitter.com/#!/karinanews

Garcia Torres did not enter a plea. Waived his right to a preliminary hearing in 60 days
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Thu May 31, 2012 5:28 pm

Honeysage wrote:http://twitter.com/#!/karinanews

Garcia Torres did not enter a plea. Waived his right to a preliminary hearing in 60 days

Not a shocker.
Well the court will most likely have to enter a not guilty plea then.
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Honeysage on Thu May 31, 2012 5:31 pm

Tamta wrote:
Honeysage wrote:http://twitter.com/#!/karinanews

Garcia Torres did not enter a plea. Waived his right to a preliminary hearing in 60 days

Not a shocker.
Well the court will most likely have to enter a not guilty plea then.

gives us more time to find Sierra!!!
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Honeysage on Thu May 31, 2012 5:37 pm

http://www.mercurynews.com/bay-area-news/ci_20753293/jailed-suspect-sierra-lamar-disappearance-court-again-enters
Jailed suspect in Sierra LaMar disappearance in court again - enters no plea

Prosecutors had filed a charge of murder against Garcia Torres in his first court appearance a week ago, but Thursday's arraignment hearing was his first formal hearing with his new attorney -- public defender Ken Mandel -- at his side.
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Thu May 31, 2012 5:42 pm

Honeysage wrote:http://www.mercurynews.com/bay-area-news/ci_20753293/jailed-suspect-sierra-lamar-disappearance-court-again-enters
Jailed suspect in Sierra LaMar disappearance in court again - enters no plea

Prosecutors had filed a charge of murder against Garcia Torres in his first court appearance a week ago, but Thursday's arraignment hearing was his first formal hearing with his new attorney -- public defender Ken Mandel -- at his side.

Do Not Enter A Plea

A Jurisdiction is a private set of laws / codes / statutes / rules / regulations of a private society.

Snipped
BBM

Regarding entering a plea...

If you plead yes Guilty, you are; 1, Accepting the entered private law in the case, and 2, Accepting that you broke the private law that you just accepted you stand under.
If you plead Not Guilty, you are; 1. Accepting the entered private law in the case, and 2, Denying that you broke the private law that you just accepted you stand under.

Either way, by entering a plea, you are not challenging their claim that they have jurisdiction over you, you are accepting that you under-stand (stand under) their law, and you are only arguing (under their private law) whether you did or did not break it.

Either way, you submit to their jurisdiction (private set of laws / rules).

- Absolutely do not enter a plea. - Do Not Plea - Do not contract with them! (3 mins)

This is in Criminal Proceedings. There is a similar way in Civil Proceedings. Either way the law must be entered into the court.

If you don't want to accept the other party's jurisdiction, then you must challenge that jurisdiction, whether it is Criminal or Civil. Only the names (titles) of the entered forms to the court differ, but it is the body - the substance - of the document that matters.


Note. There are two things that you have to be careful not to submit to...
i. The constrained jurisdiction of the court's rules - i.e. their Common Law Jurisdiction (rather than common law true).
ii. The entered private law that is being presented by the other party.

If you are going to court, you want the court under your control so that you can challenge the other party.

As Bill Thornton explains in detail, by not submitting to their Common Law Jurisdiction (which is constrained by their legal system - an extended set of private rulings) then you may establish your own "court of record", challenge the other party's jurisdiction (with a counterclaim) and enter you own rulings to be tried by yourself or the tribunal.

You can stay out of the court's offered Common Law Jurisdiction (their private constrained rulings around the common law) and stay in common law true (with the freedom to introduce any law or ruling you wish) by entering the court in special appearance only. This is best done in writing though when you make a claim or counterclaim, or a declaration to the court that you are dealing with. Then you can always simply refer to what is on record in the court.

See the counterclaim here for an example: Common Law Action. ( Procedure )http://www.tpuc.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1763


Last edited by Tamta on Thu May 31, 2012 5:50 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Honeysage on Thu May 31, 2012 6:12 pm

http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/Sierra-LaMar-Suspect--to-Appear-in-Court-Today-155963335.html
Sierra LaMar Suspect Enters No Plea

He is being represented by Santa Clara County public defender Ken Mandel, at least until he retires this summer.
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what? what's the point of having him at all...he will have to start all over again with another lawyer-this will go on forever...continuous delayed hearings.
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Thu May 31, 2012 6:14 pm

Honeysage wrote:http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/Sierra-LaMar-Suspect--to-Appear-in-Court-Today-155963335.html
Sierra LaMar Suspect Enters No Plea

He is being represented by Santa Clara County public defender Ken Mandel, at least until he retires this summer.
_______________________________

what? what's the point of having him at all...he will have to start all over again with another lawyer-this will go on forever...continuous delayed hearings.

Well the pre-lim is waived.
We have no clue as to the strength if the evidence.

Maybe it will move faster ...
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Lash on Thu May 31, 2012 6:43 pm

Wow. I have been out of pocket today.

Here is a start to statements made by Marlene. Source is from HLN transcripts.
http://edition.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/

Marlene on texting Sierra NG on 3-23-2012

GRACE: And when did you first learn, Miss Lamar, that she was actually missing and how did you learn? 

LAMAR: Well, I usually text her before leaving my work, and it was about 3:45 that I leave. And I didn`t get a response. I tried again. I didn`t get a response. And then I drove home. 

Marlene on texting Sierra NG on 4-4-2012

MARLENE LAMAR, MOTHER OF SIERRA LAMAR: The 7:11 and tried to catch the bus, usually leave the house at 7:15 and catches the bus at 7:25. And we don`t know what happened after that. I do know that I received an e- mail at 6:00 from Sobrada high school stating that she was not in attendance, but I got suspicious because I usually text her before I leave for work to see if she`s OK because she`ll be home by usually 4:00, 4:15, and I just check in with her and tried multiple times, four times. 

Marlene on borrowing clothes JVM on 4-3-2012

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, Marlene -- I want to go to the mother. Why would she have a change of clothes in her purse? 

LAMAR: Well, I`ve seen her borrow clothes frequently from her friends, and they would borrow clothes from her, as well. So I would see her bring a pair of pants that she`s returning that she borrowed to a friend and a blouse. So as far as clothes being in her purse, you know, that happened frequently, you know. She loved clothes, and she would borrow frequently from them and vice versa. They would borrow clothes from her, as well. 

Marlene on borrowing clothes NG on 4-4-2012

LAMAR: Well, she would -- 

GRACE: Miss Lamar? 

LAMAR: Yes. She would borrow things frequently from her friends, and her friends would borrow her clothes as well. And my daughter, as far as packing a suitcase, was usually packed in a neat fashion. 
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Lash on Thu May 31, 2012 7:26 pm

Marlene drove to the HS that afternoon, made frantic calls to friends and family - Source Mercury News 3-28-2012

Snip-http://www.mercurynews.com/education/ci_20276255/sierra-lamars-disappearance-raises-questions-about-how-schools

The time lag cost critical search hours and frustrated Marlene LaMar, who drove to the high school that March 16 afternoon hoping her 15-year-old daughter missed the bus home. After more frantic calls to friends and family, she called police 27 minutes after receiving the 6 p.m. email that her daughter never showed up for school.

"They had no idea of the situation before they got that email," Sierra's older sister, Danielle LaMar, 21, said of her parents. "Especially in this case, time definitely matters."
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Freckles on Thu May 31, 2012 7:28 pm

Lash wrote:Wow. I have been out of pocket today.

Here is a start to statements made by Marlene. Source is from HLN transcripts.
http://edition.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/

Marlene on texting Sierra NG on 3-23-2012

GRACE: And when did you first learn, Miss Lamar, that she was actually missing and how did you learn?

LAMAR: Well, I usually text her before leaving my work, and it was about 3:45 that I leave. And I didn`t get a response. I tried again. I didn`t get a response. And then I drove home.

Marlene on texting Sierra NG on 4-4-2012

MARLENE LAMAR, MOTHER OF SIERRA LAMAR: The 7:11 and tried to catch the bus, usually leave the house at 7:15 and catches the bus at 7:25. And we don`t know what happened after that. I do know that I received an e- mail at 6:00 from Sobrada high school stating that she was not in attendance, but I got suspicious because I usually text her before I leave for work to see if she`s OK because she`ll be home by usually 4:00, 4:15, and I just check in with her and tried multiple times, four times.

Marlene on borrowing clothes JVM on 4-3-2012

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, Marlene -- I want to go to the mother. Why would she have a change of clothes in her purse?

LAMAR: Well, I`ve seen her borrow clothes frequently from her friends, and they would borrow clothes from her, as well. So I would see her bring a pair of pants that she`s returning that she borrowed to a friend and a blouse. So as far as clothes being in her purse, you know, that happened frequently, you know. She loved clothes, and she would borrow frequently from them and vice versa. They would borrow clothes from her, as well.

Marlene on borrowing clothes NG on 4-4-2012

LAMAR: Well, she would --

GRACE: Miss Lamar?

LAMAR: Yes. She would borrow things frequently from her friends, and her friends would borrow her clothes as well. And my daughter, as far as packing a suitcase, was usually packed in a neat fashion.
Much appreciated, Lash! Cleared up some issues for me.


So if she was unable to reach her daughter at the early time, 3:45 PM, what did she do next?
Why wait hours before notifying anyone?
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Freckles on Thu May 31, 2012 8:25 pm

What time did Sierra call the PD for assistance?
Has anyone heard the tape?
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Lash on Thu May 31, 2012 8:31 pm

You're welcome Freckles!

After putting together the timing. I don't believe Sierra would be home until 4:00ish. Marlene was driving from Fremont to Morgan Hill, a 40-45 minute drive per Google Maps. I don't believe it was at 3:45 when Marlene started to worry. It was the unanswered text messages around 4:00-4:15. In my opinion once Marlene got home around 4:30 and did not see Sierra that was when the worry really began.

The article I posted from Mercury News states Marlene drove to the HS that afternoon. Since afternoon is before 6:00pm. I am assuming that is what Marlene did next, drove to Sobrato HS. The article states Marlene made "more" calls to friends and family. In my opinion Marlene once returning from the HS attempted to make phone calls. Marlene did not need Sierra's cell phone to call make phone calls. Even though she choose to leave the team, when Sierra first moved to MH she joined a competitive cheerleading team. It is common to share rides to practice and meets, usually exchanging phone numbers. I think it is fair to speculate Marlene had the phone numbers of some of the mothers. Sierra did also make some friends in MH. I think it is feasible Marlene attempted to contact some of these people.

In my opinion there is evidence to show that Marlene and even Steve made attempts to call friends, family and drive to her HS before receiving a 6:00 email. Then after further phone calls, then called LE. However, it is all my opinion.
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Thu May 31, 2012 8:49 pm

Freckles wrote:
Lash wrote:Wow. I have been out of pocket today.

Here is a start to statements made by Marlene. Source is from HLN transcripts.
http://edition.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/

Marlene on texting Sierra NG on 3-23-2012

GRACE: And when did you first learn, Miss Lamar, that she was actually missing and how did you learn?

LAMAR: Well, I usually text her before leaving my work, and it was about 3:45 that I leave. And I didn`t get a response. I tried again. I didn`t get a response. And then I drove home.

Marlene on texting Sierra NG on 4-4-2012

MARLENE LAMAR, MOTHER OF SIERRA LAMAR: The 7:11 and tried to catch the bus, usually leave the house at 7:15 and catches the bus at 7:25. And we don`t know what happened after that. I do know that I received an e- mail at 6:00 from Sobrada high school stating that she was not in attendance, but I got suspicious because I usually text her before I leave for work to see if she`s OK because she`ll be home by usually 4:00, 4:15, and I just check in with her and tried multiple times, four times.

Marlene on borrowing clothes JVM on 4-3-2012

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, Marlene -- I want to go to the mother. Why would she have a change of clothes in her purse?

LAMAR: Well, I`ve seen her borrow clothes frequently from her friends, and they would borrow clothes from her, as well. So I would see her bring a pair of pants that she`s returning that she borrowed to a friend and a blouse. So as far as clothes being in her purse, you know, that happened frequently, you know. She loved clothes, and she would borrow frequently from them and vice versa. They would borrow clothes from her, as well.

Marlene on borrowing clothes NG on 4-4-2012

LAMAR: Well, she would --

GRACE: Miss Lamar?

LAMAR: Yes. She would borrow things frequently from her friends, and her friends would borrow her clothes as well. And my daughter, as far as packing a suitcase, was usually packed in a neat fashion.
Much appreciated, Lash! Cleared up some issues for me.


So if she was unable to reach her daughter at the early time, 3:45 PM, what did she do next?
Why wait hours before notifying anyone?

BBM

This is interesting.

I remember it.

I am going to post the link to the interview after I put my kids to bed,
but it was a Today show or GMA where ML and SL both allude to the fact that
they are baffled as to why Sierra would pack her bag like that.

Laurie Smith is also in this video and it is filmed at night at Marlene's house.
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Thu May 31, 2012 8:56 pm

Jailed suspect in Sierra LaMar disappearance enters no plea in second court appearance


BBM
Snips

-Garcia Torres said, "Yes your honor," when Judge Jerome Nadler asked if he understood he was waiving his right to a speedy trial. His next hearing was scheduled for July 10.

-Prosecutors had filed a charge of murder against Garcia Torres in his first court appearance a week ago, but Thursday's hearing was his first formal hearing with his new attorney at his side. District attorney Jeff Rosen said following that first court appearance that he won't decide whether to pursue the death penalty against Garcia Torres until his office completes a full review of the evidence.

Garcia Torres was also charged with kidnapping by Morgan Hill police, who say they believe he carried out at least one other attack in the parking lot of the Safeway. They're investigating him as a possible suspect in three unsolved assaults in supermarket parking lots in March 2009. But if he's found innocent of murder, prosecutors won't be able to try him on the kidnapping charge. "The DA's office has pinned its entire case on the murder," Clark said. "It's a risky strategy when the evidence is as complicated as it is in this case."


http://www.mercurynews.com/sierra-lamar/ci_20753293/jailed-suspect-sierra-lamar-disappearance-court-again-enters
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Lash on Thu May 31, 2012 9:11 pm

Marlene worried when she came home and reached out to friends -
Source ABC news 3-22-2012

Snip- http://abcnewsradioonline.com/national-news/tag/sierra-lamar#ixzz1wV1z0xw6

Marlene LaMar became worried after her daughter didn’t return home from school last Friday.

“I was worried when I came home and she wasn’t here,” Marlene LaMar told ABC News.  ”That’s when my adrenaline, that fear kicked in.  That’s when a mother has that instinct that something isn’t quite right here.”

They reached out to the teen’s friends, but they grew more concerned when one friend said Sierra wasn’t in class earlier that day.  They decided to contact authorities around 5 p.m. Friday, after her high school sent them an e-mail saying she didn’t show up for school at all that day.

Marlene LaMar told ABC News that her daughter’s bus driver said the teen never got on the bus the morning of her disappearance.

( 5:00 time not correct )
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Lash on Thu May 31, 2012 9:23 pm

Freckles wrote:What time did Sierra call the PD for assistance?
Has anyone heard the tape?

Everything that I have have read gives a 6:30 time. I don't know if the family called 911 or the MH PD. I have never seen an official police report. I tend to believe 911 was not called because 911 tapes have not been requested by media, released, discussed, etc...just my opinion.
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by SweetT on Thu May 31, 2012 10:56 pm

I thought all lawyers told their clients to enter not guilty pleas. Wonder why the "No Plea" Whats the benefit in this? Does anyone know?
Also, I have raised 5 kids 2 of which are my step children. My oldest daughter is 27 and living in Costa Rica, I also have a 22 yr old daughter and a 21 yr old, a 20 yr old son in the military and a 15 yr old son who is still at home. He and his sisters all had cell phones etc. But we always have/had dinner together even after I worked sometimes over 60 hrs per week. I will say the middle girls were terrible when they were in their teens and did manage to get into lots of trouble. But it was not due to bad parenting, just lousy choice of friends/habits etc. Stuff happens, just saying. I also now have a 2 yr old grand daughter and I hope she does not give her mommy as much problems as her mommy gave us. LOL! My kids weren't perfect, but they were and are always loved. Glad they have grown into wonderful people and my son is a blessing as is my grand daughter. Well they all are, but those girls were a handful when they were younger. :)

PS: Glad I missed the fireworks earlier, had to work.
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Thu May 31, 2012 10:58 pm

SweetT wrote:I thought all lawyers told their clients to enter not guilty pleas. Wonder why the "No Plea" Whats the benefit in this? Does anyone know?
Also, I have raised 5 kids 2 of which are my step children. My oldest daughter is 27 and living in Costa Rica, I also have a 22 yr old daughter and a 21 yr old, a 20 yr old son in the military and a 15 yr old son who is still at home. He and his sisters all had cell phones etc. But we always have/had dinner together even after I worked sometimes over 60 hrs per week. I will say the middle girls were terrible when they were in their teens and did manage to get into lots of trouble. But it was not due to bad parenting, just lousy choice of friends/habits etc. Stuff happens, just saying. I also now have a 2 yr old grand daughter and I hope she does not give her mommy as much problems as her mommy gave us. LOL! My kids weren't perfect, but they were and are always loved. Glad they have grown into wonderful people and my son is a blessing as is my grand daughter. Well they all are, but those girls were a handful when they were younger. :)

Hi Sweet Tea,

LoOk up a couple of posts to mine about No Plea!
You are a saint!
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by SweetT on Thu May 31, 2012 11:13 pm

Tamta: No Saint, but I was very tired and at one point ready to move out of the country and not tell those kids where we moved to...LOL! (Sarcasm just in case some one thinks I would have actually done it) .. I will look back a few posts, thanks. Very Happy
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by kimi_SFC on Thu May 31, 2012 11:40 pm

Hey yall....

Glad I missed the fireworks as well. Found this video today and thought I'd share. My heart is beyond broken and tears are falling for Sierra and the LaMar family.

Sad


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w99kGnzl5rQ&feature=youtube_gdata_player


Sierra needs to come home. She's the reason we're here, exchanging ideas, cyber sleuthing, and fighting the digital good fight. I appreciate the RESPECTFUL forum we have here. It's a reflection of how we view the victims and a testament to where so many of us came from (THM).

*stepping off my soapbox now to go hug my kids*
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by nanaof4 on Thu May 31, 2012 11:46 pm

Freckles wrote:
Stolat wrote:
Lash wrote:
Typo Positive wrote:At Stolat:

The reference to that intersection is pertaining to statements made that brought him up on their radar.
"He was seen on that route a fact that did not escape
LE notice".
Was that before or after they supposedly had his DNA in
her possessions?
I mean if before, why were they targeting him?
And if after, well if you've got his DNA and he drives to
work not avoiding the area as usual, it doesn't make sense really either.

If the lab doing the testing were already in trouble for
mishandling of evidence and wrongful convictions, I don't believe I'd be mistating any facts about that evidence in
public like I could lie because I'm LE.
There was no reason to lie about whether they were looking for the car or already had it.
The alleged perp knew they had his car.
So why lie to the public?
Why give a false picture of a car one day and an alleged
correct one the very next and say it is cctv footage that
conveniently has no date/time stamp?

If this were my case there wouldn't be a hint of lying to the public or making any false statements regarding the evidence, at all.
For any reason whatsoever.

BBM - I do believe they mislead the public, but they did not lie. They chose their words wisely. I also believe there was a reason and a hell of a good one. Smart. In my opinion they were looking for someone who could remember seeing this car in a specific location. A location that may point to the location of Sierra's body.

Agreed. That's my understanding as well -- they knew they'd have a lock-in if he could lead them to her body.

I never once read where they were "looking for a car". not once.

They never said anything other than asking for inforamtion about the car or information about the driver. This was even discussed here the very next day after the public reslease went out. I would like to see the lie in that. It is exactly as they stated -- they truly were looking for information about the driver --to compare against any foreseable alibi he might provide -- and so in doing so they, in fact, spoke the absolute truth. No where did they owe it to the public (which might jeapardize their investigation) that they were looking for information to compare against an alibi. If anyone misinterpreted those words to mean something other than what the words indicated then that may be attributed to that person's preconceived notions about the intent of the inquiry. But to me, I've yet to see someone be able to produce the words that constituted any lie.
Huh? Why else put out news media stating they were seeking info on a red car seen in the area.
Then, a red car with a black hood seen in the area.
Then, a red Jetta car with a black hood seen in the area.
Then, a red Jetta car with a black hood seen in the area AND caught on video.
Then, a red Jetta car with a black hood seen in the area and caught on video AND looks like THIS!

Ooops! Someone forgot to tell me! We already have taken control of THAT vehicle!

I am not convinced he did this crime.
There was plenty of time to plant evidence BEFORE they told anyone they had the car.
Yes, I think it IS probable he committed the Safeway crimes : They had the artist sketches up shortly after the crimes were committed and it does appear to be him for those crimes.

We STILL don't know WHAT HAPPENED to Sierra; WHEN did it happened; WHERE is she?

Give me more evidence to make me a believer. (DNA IS transferable or could be planted later, right Det. Van Allen???)

Regarding the car, remember Casey Anthony? She had the car but LE had to show she had sole possession. In this case, LE had the car, knew it was in the areas where Sierra went missing and where her cell and purse were discarded. They had to connect him with the car at the times on the video. The surveillance videos did not show who was driving. I would say that in putting a little out there, and then more info, LE did finally get people to step up and connect him with that car on those dates and places.

Before AGT was charged, the name of the game was not to reveal what evidence they had so he could not destroy possible evidence or alibi up with some of his friends and family who would be willing to lie to get him off. Now, we are entering into the discovery phase where certain evidence will have to be given to AGT's attorney. We may or may not get to see the evidence prior to trial, depending on California laws. However, with the Anthony trial, some evidence was presented at trial that was never disclosed to the public through the Sunshine Law because of the evidentiary value.

I don't like not knowing what evidence is there, but because of media sensationalizing these cases, we can pretty much bet that LE is going to tell us as little as possible to avoid issues at trial. That also includes not arresting the suspect before they have sufficient evidence. I believe LE when they say they ended up arresting him because they didn't want another little girl missing. We have no idea what they witnessed during surveillance of AGT before he knew they were following him (if he indeed did know before he and his family was interviewed and his car impounded. Although, if I was guilty, I would definately be paranoid that I was being watched after being interviewed). The Anthony trial taught LE what not to do in dealing with the media and public. I find it amusing that so many doubt LE because LE is not running all the evidence by the blogs for approval. Pre Anthony, we would never have expected to know much of anything until the trial.

Guess to make a long opinion short, we don't know enough to scream LE misconduct, he is innocent, or there is not enough evidence.

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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by ClaireUncensored on Fri Jun 01, 2012 12:46 am

kimi_SFC wrote:Hey yall....

Glad I missed the fireworks as well. Found this video today and thought I'd share. My heart is beyond broken and tears are falling for Sierra and the LaMar family. This video is well done, and I hope someone is collecting all of these beautiful creations for the LeMar family (for later on, when they're ready).

Sad
(video respectfully snipped by me for space ~~ C)

Sierra needs to come home. She's the reason we're here, exchanging ideas, cyber sleuthing, and fighting the digital good fight. I appreciate the RESPECTFUL forum we have here. It's a reflection of how we view the victims and a testament to where so many of us came from (THM). >>>> Well said!

*stepping off my soapbox now to go hug my kids*

Every time I see pictures of Sierra I just am reminded that she is/was such a stunning young lady (as is her sister). Being taken away from her close friends at the age of 15 is very, very hard; I speak from experience -- except we moved from Ohio to SC (what a culture shock). By that age, cliques are long-formed and one never really fits in anywhere during those last 3 years of HS.

At least Sierra was a short car ride away and had the advantage of SM. She didn't seem to "want" for anything (had nicer-than-most) "things" which are so very important to girls at that age. I really don't know what the relationship was between Sierra and her mom, but I can pretty much bet the "move" was more than likely a continuous issue (no matter why/if the decision was made for her to change school districts since so far it seems we heard some local gossip -- which made sense early on -- but now I've decided to put it on the back burner, so to speak because it's just so insignificant at this point IMO. (Was it SuperMom who spoke of some incident? Early on back on THM? Rarely posts anymore. I just can't remember tonight; so late for me.

Thanks for the link which was beautiful, touching and shows an always-smiling Sierra.

Whew. I need sleep/chocolate isn't working. Sleep
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by justanopinion on Fri Jun 01, 2012 8:54 am

I think that my problem with Marlene totally stems from her language and it makes me question if they arrested the right person?

when Marlene uses language like "I usually leave work at ...." there seems to be the second part of the sentence missing; the specific for example "but today I left at ...."
"Sierra usually leaves for the bus @ " which then implies she has no specific reference...
The story from Marlene has been embellished over time; for example the placing of lunch money in the pocket of the purse.
Marlene does not seem to be detail oriented. Which makes me assume (and yes I realize....) that either she was not paying much attention or really did not spend much time with Sierra.

Sierra's Twitter and Tumbler accounts paint a picture of not a close relationship between mother and daughter.

So here I sit on the fence about whether the person arrested is indeed guilty but time will tell.

As for Marlene I think that she is in her own private hell not only because her daughter is missing and may be deceased but because there may be some regrets for the way their relationship had become! The white elephant in the room in her home must be enormous!! JUST MY OPINION and not meant to offend anyone. I truly hope that Sierra can be returned to her family and that the healing can start.
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Stolat on Fri Jun 01, 2012 9:06 am

Lash wrote:You're welcome Freckles!

After putting together the timing. I don't believe Sierra would be home until 4:00ish. Marlene was driving from Fremont to Morgan Hill, a 40-45 minute drive per Google Maps. I don't believe it was at 3:45 when Marlene started to worry. It was the unanswered text messages around 4:00-4:15. In my opinion once Marlene got home around 4:30 and did not see Sierra that was when the worry really began.

The article I posted from Mercury News states Marlene drove to the HS that afternoon. Since afternoon is before 6:00pm. I am assuming that is what Marlene did next, drove to Sobrato HS. The article states Marlene made "more" calls to friends and family. In my opinion Marlene once returning from the HS attempted to make phone calls. Marlene did not need Sierra's cell phone to call make phone calls. Even though she choose to leave the team, when Sierra first moved to MH she joined a competitive cheerleading team. It is common to share rides to practice and meets, usually exchanging phone numbers. I think it is fair to speculate Marlene had the phone numbers of some of the mothers. Sierra did also make some friends in MH. I think it is feasible Marlene attempted to contact some of these people.

In my opinion there is evidence to show that Marlene and even Steve made attempts to call friends, family and drive to her HS before receiving a 6:00 email. Then after further phone calls, then called LE. However, it is all my opinion.

Thanks for all the timelines Lash - great work. I don't have the link, but I think it had been cleared up earlier that the competitive cheerleading time she joined was at Freemont and she had not joined any teams upon transferring to MH. I think that was substantiated some time ago. She only joined one cheer team in her Freshman year, and that was at Freemont. It would have likely been too late to join MH in the middle of the year.
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Fri Jun 01, 2012 10:01 am

Cellphone of Missing Calif. Teen Sierra LaMar Yields No Leads

Snipped
BBM

Marlene LaMar became worried after her daughter didn’t return home from school Friday.
I was worried when I came home and she wasn’t here,” Marlene LaMar told ABC News.



http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/03/cellphone-of-missing-calif-teen-sierra-lamar-yields-no-leads/
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Fri Jun 01, 2012 10:31 am

Rally scheduled for Sierra LaMar at Fremont's Washington High School


Snipped.

The rally's speakers will include family, friends and search volunteers, said Joanna Isom, a LaMar family friend and event co-organizer.

"This is about spreading the hope that Sierra will be found alive," Isom said. "This is not over until it's over."

"We're thankful he's caught," Isom said. "But we're still at square one until Sierra is found. All we can do is have hope and faith."


BBM
I believe this is the mother of the girl that received the last Tweet sent from Sierra's laptop. SHe is a minor so I will not name her in case it breaks a rule here..


http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_20755347/rally-scheduled-sierra-lamar-at-fremonts-washington-high
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Tamta on Fri Jun 01, 2012 10:38 am

Okay: MY DEAD HORSE


Back to my persisting question about why a Statement of Facts was released and only a Statement of PRobable Cause has been mentioned, though not released, in the press.

Statement of Facts is a narrative of facts in a case of Civil Action.

Statement of Probable Cause is the narrative of facts in a Criminal Ca
se.

Anyone with CA statute knowledge?

Is this standard to start Civil action(wrongful death suit maybe) with this type of crime in CA or the US, or is a Civil and Criminal Case being simultaneously brought forth against Torres?

What is going on here?


http://ftpcontent.worldnow.com/kion/statement_of_fact.pdf

http://wap.ktvu.com/site.htm?targetUrl=http://www.ktvu.com/news/news/crime-law/garcia-torres-set-enter-plea-sierra-lamar-case/nPH2D/

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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

Post by Stolat on Fri Jun 01, 2012 11:32 am

Tamta wrote:Rally scheduled for Sierra LaMar at Fremont's Washington High School


Snipped.

The rally's speakers will include family, friends and search volunteers, said Joanna Isom, a LaMar family friend and event co-organizer.

"This is about spreading the hope that Sierra will be found alive," Isom said. "This is not over until it's over."

"We're thankful he's caught," Isom said. "But we're still at square one until Sierra is found. All we can do is have hope and faith."


BBM
I believe this is the mother of the girl that received the last Tweet sent from Sierra's laptop. SHe is a minor so I will not name her in case it breaks a rule here..


http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_20755347/rally-scheduled-sierra-lamar-at-fremonts-washington-high

Very well could be. It appears Joanna has helped coordinate at least 3 other separate events, vigils or fundraisers for Sierra's benefit. So she seems pretty involved and committed.
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Re: Sierra Lamar -- Missing 3/16/12 #2

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