Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by stark3923 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:31 pm

crap - im going to vegas tomorrow.......ugg. they said closing today. shame on prosecution obsessive questioning of mott...pfftt....

can i get a link to the proof of a passed poly?
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:31 pm

Art, the way this group travels , we shouldn't get passed the first 33 sidebars by 10am. I know there isn't usually side bars with closing, but this is not a usual judge
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:33 pm

Stark, I don't have a link but on IS earlier Vinnie was interviewing the uncle. He asked uncle what he would want people to know about Adam. he said that he took a polygraph and passed.

He did not say who administered the poly though
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:34 pm

Closing today????
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by angiefly2 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:36 pm

I thought the judge just said they were doing closing arguments today???? Did I miss something?
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:37 pm

Thats what I understand Angie
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:37 pm

Stark are you doing your happy dance and Art you can join her
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by stark3923 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:38 pm

court in rec.

adam has a ton of family n friends in court right now (that testimony is over with)..... lots of hugging lots of support in court for adam n seth n their dad....
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by back2back19 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:40 pm

How long is the recess?

I was hoping the closing would be tomorrow. Maybe HLN will carry it?

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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by stark3923 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:41 pm

10
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by back2back19 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:43 pm

Thanks!

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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by angiefly2 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:03 pm

http://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local/hoping-for-a-perry-mason-moment-78735627.html
snipped:
Kaufman's lawyers also gave the judge a polygraph test result, in which Kaufman gave an emphatic, "No!" to questions about killing his wife. "Inconclusive" was the result the first time, but the examiner ruled "strongly inferring the truth" on the second try.

"He did not kill his wife and the polygraph examiner determined that he was truthful in his responses," Matthewman said.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by back2back19 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:08 pm

Erm, this closing isn't doing it for me. :/

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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by stark3923 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:09 pm

angiefly2 = thank you for your kindness and hard work - the link is greatly appreciated.


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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:11 pm

I find this prosecutor irritating. I think its because I don't like what he is saying. If their house was worth $800,000, I would like to know when they bought it. I say that because at the height of the real estate boom, my house was worth 750000, now maybe 350. Real Estate down here has been an incredible roller coaster, so he infers that this was a palace, maybe not so much. The square footage is same as my house. I just have a regular house. not a mansion.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by angiefly2 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:14 pm

yw Stark :)
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:18 pm

Pros defining excusable homicide, accidental homicide, etc. giving examples

He says that we know that Lina and Adam didn't have a perfect marriage because perfect marriages don't end like this...assuming he showed the jury pictures.

He is discounting all the different homicides working his way up to 2nd degree.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:22 pm

what defendent did to his wife is not excusable, justifiable

What did State have to prove: 3 elements: Lina Kaufman is dead

death caused by husband

imminatly dangerous to another with depraved mind

state says they proved this

He did this by putting his hands around her neck and squeezing life out of her
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:26 pm

she had deep injuries to her neck. significant force to neck. He should have known that this kind of force would kill her

you put force on wife's neck to where she dropped over dead. he showed indifference to life when he did this to his wife

Not necessary for State to prove that he meant to cause death. He emphasized NOT 3x

He should have know this was immenaately dangerous

Evidence in front of you demonstrated 2nd degree murder

You as jury will still have choice of lesser included crime,

we have proven 2nd dgree murder but if you don't think so you have manslaughter choice

to prove this: 2 elements Lina Kaufman is dead


adam K intentionally committed act to cause the death of Lina
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:32 pm

Pros. again defining excusable or justifiable...these don't apply here

don't have to prove that he intended to cause death, but he should have known that kind of pressure would cause her death

Thats the law

Lesser included charge, judge will tell you the instructions,

you must find him guilty of the highest degree of crime

discussing evidence:

911 call...you have to play that again in the jury room, "my wife is upstairs"

why did he go downstairs to call 911 why is he down there when there is a phone upstairs.

"There are marks over her neck" so there you have it before fire rescue got there....it was an insult to rescue by Dr. Baden to say fire rescue was frustrated

he said he was the only one there to open door but an older hispanic woman opened the door...how did that happen...doesn't make sense
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:38 pm

She was in the bathroom...what does that mean? why doesn't he say she is in the bathroom

he told 911 3x she didn't fall

says she doesn't have any medical history...nothing about the fainting or dizzy or anything

Could the firefighters make better reports, yes probably, but they go on many calls in Miami Dade county. They have no reason to lie, they never know which cases are coming up for trial 5 years later

don't focus on fire rescue being 15 minutes late, focus on unexplained injuries.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:39 pm

To suggest that these injuries are because fire rescue rammed Lina into the wall is an insult.

No how much defense wants you to believe that, it doesn't make sense
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:42 pm

fire rescue didn't cause injuries.

Defendent isn't acting normal, he was hysterical, calm back to hysterical (according to fire capt.)

Says he was fully dressed that was odd, wife naked, he was asleep, now he's fully dressed

intubated failed twice

Castro says they had to move her into the bedroom

objection (don't know why) Judge says strike

LE overheard first version of what defendent told that day
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:45 pm

Hands bagged in hospital

another objection and sustained

During the deposition the defense wouldn't let him look at his report, why is that?

When I let him look at report, he then gave accurate answers. (this was LE I think)

Myers said he saw him with long pants, watch and shoes and cologne

He heard both versions that day about the toilet with head on rim and the second with her slumped over the magazine rack

something is not right here
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:47 pm

The ME office knew from the beginning that this was some sort of asphyxial death. They wanted to do investigation. It took 17 months but if they rushed to judgement, we would be sitting here complaining that we rushed to judgement.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by Chickenbutt on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:49 pm

ok...home again and caught up on the thread....how is he doing?
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:49 pm

This is a big city, people come and go so if the case was handed off, that's life. Things are perfect, nothing is perfect.

Imagine Dr. Hyma trying to line up one to one interviews with the various fire rescue people who were working in other precincts now. It was quite an undertaking but Dr. Hyma wanted to do it.

It had nothing to do with Adam Kaufman calling Tallahassee to complain about him
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:50 pm

WB CB, glad you're back, I'll rest now. He is just reiterating the State's case. I guess he is doing ok, but there is much that I don't buy.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by back2back19 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:53 pm

I just don't like this lawyer but he isn't doing badly. I just don't think they've proven their case.

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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:02 pm

Well, it was ok, but less than dynamic. At least for me.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by Chickenbutt on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:03 pm

thank you tess for all the narrative. I sure do appreciate it. Now I have 2 rug rats to deal with...lol
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by angiefly2 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:03 pm

Pros closing went for approx 45 minutes... I was timing it but didn't start until a bit into the closing.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by Chickenbutt on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:04 pm

Oh sorry....and thank you to everyone who was posting for me to catch up.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by Chickenbutt on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:04 pm

The pros said this morning he would need an hour and a half
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:05 pm

Are they going to get a rebuttal closing? They did in the Casey case.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by angiefly2 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:07 pm

Did you all hear that??? "Dateline, hey Dateline, get this on camera... I'm ordering Pizza tonight" Thats what the pros. who was just doing closings just said WTH does that even mean?
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:08 pm

Guess they just realized they had a hot mike
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by angiefly2 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:12 pm

as of right now how would you vote if you were on this jury?
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:13 pm

I would vote NG, to my mind they haven't proven what they said they did.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by angiefly2 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:14 pm

I agree. I can't wait to hear the defense closing!
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by back2back19 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:17 pm

NG. Not even remotely saying AK is innocent(I have no idea what the heck happened that night and no one else does either, hence the vast array of professional opinions) but I don't think the state has proven it's case. Like at all.


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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by back2back19 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:19 pm

angiefly2 wrote:Did you all hear that??? "Dateline, hey Dateline, get this on camera... I'm ordering Pizza tonight" Thats what the pros. who was just doing closings just said WTH does that even mean?

If I had to guess, I think he thinks he won the case. No

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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by Chickenbutt on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:21 pm

NG!
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by jacct on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:21 pm

NG, too much reasonable doubt for me and not enough evidence that Adam strangled her.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:22 pm

I have no audio!!
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by angiefly2 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:22 pm

Is Dateline really there I wonder? Because they do often follow cases before and during the process of trial.
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by tesstruhart on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:23 pm

Come on Cnn no audio for defense closing??
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by back2back19 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:23 pm

Why is there no audio? Ugh. :/

Edited:

Back. Yay!


Last edited by back2back19 on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:23 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by jacct on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:23 pm

CNN has no audio, I wonder if the Judge needs to turn it on?
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

Post by jacct on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:24 pm

Finally, audio back
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Re: Adam Kaufman Murder Trial (murder of Eleonora Kaufman - 11/7/07 - Aventura, FL) #2

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