George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 12:05 pm

Witness: John Donnelly - Friend of Zimmerman

11:58 a.m.

De la Rionda asks if he listened to Zimmerman’s call to the non-emergency line.

He says he heard part of it on the news, but isn’t sure what parts.

De la Rionda plays the call.

11:56 a.m.

Donnelly says the screams are Zimmerman’s

“There’s absolutely no doubt in my mind that is George Zimmerman and I wish to god I did not have that ability to understand that,” Donnelly says.

O’Mara finishes questioning.

De la Rionda begins cross examination.

He asks about the deposition, describing it as brief.

De la Rionda asks if he ever mentioned identifying the voice.

Donnelly says he doesn’t remember being asked if he was going to testify about it.

De la Rionda asks about him listening to the recording last Saturday.

Donnelly says he always walked away when the recording was playing.

He says he thinks he needed to listen to it before today.

De la Rionda asks about the number of times he played.

Donnelly says he doesn’t know why he played it twice, but it was an emotional experience for him.

De la Rionda asks if he discussed it with his wife.

Donnelly says they never tried to discuss much with the case.

He says he gave a check for $2,500 for the defense and then donated $500 on the website. He also bought the clothes on sale.

Donnelly says Zimmerman is a dear friend.

http://www.cfnews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2013/7/8/zimmerman_day_20.html
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 12:11 pm

Defense witnesses: Zimmerman was crying for help

Posted on Monday, 07.08.13
BY EVAN S. BENN


SANFORD -- Two of George Zimmerman’s best friends — a married couple who wrote a book on the case — testified Monday that they could hear their friend yelling for help on a 911 call before the gunshot that killed 17-year-old Trayvon Martin.

“Yes, definitely, it’s Georgie,” said Sondra Osterman, who referred to Zimmerman by that nickname several times on the witness stand. “I just hear it. I hear him screaming.”

Neither Osterman nor her husband, Mark, who last week testified as a state’s witness, could say Monday how many copies of their book, Defending Our Friend: The Most Hated Man in America, have been sold. Sondra Osterman said under cross-examination that proceeds from the book are in a savings account to be given to Zimmerman “after the trial.”

Read more:

http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/07/08/3490191/defense-witnesses-zimmerman-was.html#storylink=cpy
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 12:14 pm

Witness: John Donnelly - Friend of Zimmerman

12:08 p.m.

De la Rionda asks if Zimmerman sounds a little more excited than usual.

Donnelly says no. He says Zimmerman is trying to give law enforcement information.

De la Rionda asks about the 911 call with the screams.

Donnelly says there is no doubt in his mind it was Zimmerman. He says the screams in particular sounded like him, adding that he has heard a 250-pound man sound like a little girl but knew who it was, referring to his time as a medic in Vietnam.

De la Rionda asks if he would be able to pick out a new person’s voice he wasn’t familiar with.

Donnelly confirms he couldn’t.

De la Rionda says he has a matter to bring up before the court.

O’Mara re-directs.

He asks if all of the screams were from Zimmerman.

Donnelly confirms. He says it was one person and easy for him to identify Zimmerman.

He says he never discussed the non-emergency call with his wife.

He says he called O’Mara Saturday afternoon and it was the first time he decided he could testify about the call.

He says it was an emotional decision.

“This courtroom is about truth at some point in time even though this is personally very hard for me. This is the place truth is supposed to come out,” Donnelly says.

Donnelly is excused.

The attorneys approach for a sidebar.

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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 12:15 pm

12:12 p.m.

The jury is released for lunch until 1:30 p.m.
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Freckles on Mon Jul 08, 2013 12:16 pm

I was thinking of those two microscopic scratches to GZ's head and comparing that to the paper cut... from the JA trial.

I know I have gotten worse paper cuts than those two scratches located on GZ' head...
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by LottieM on Mon Jul 08, 2013 12:23 pm

Wow! I just heard the 911 call with the screaming and gun shot for the first time all the way through. Only heard pieces before. I have it on tape and backed it up and listened over and over....and Wow!

Of course, that IS George screaming. No doubt about that because his tone and note range is the same as his speaking voice only elevated like up an octave -for lack of a better way to describe what I'm saying. But the most important thing I got from hearing it is....

I think the gun went off by accident! I think George, being scared and all, squeezed as one naturally would when tense and it went off.  My opinion is based on the shot going off too soon behind the last scream. There should have been a pause between the scream and the shot if he had DECIDED he had to shoot rather than scream anymore.

Why not say it was an accident? Because then it's manslaughter for sure. Self Defense is a better argument if you hope to not get jail time.
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by carlakay on Mon Jul 08, 2013 12:38 pm

LottieM wrote:

Carla,
I wonder if it's possible TM thought Z was going for his gun when Z 'said' he reached into his pocket for his cell phone. And of course, as Z 'said' he had put his cell in his other pocket. I thought this part of Z's story was a little TMI (too much information). I wonder if he did go for his gun at that point and that's why TM socked him in the nose. But this is something that isn't going to play at the trial since we only have Z's rendition. And maybe he was going for his cell.....I was attacked once in my truck in a parking lot by my crazy as crap non-biological sister. The first thing I did to 'defend myself' was to grab my cell and let her know if she didn't back off I was calling 911. She didn't back off so I did call and she's still attacking me while I'm on the phone with 911. I yelled at her that the cops were hearing all this stuff she was saying, threats etc. She was oblivious and was still beside my truck throwing punches through the window -that she had broken- when the cops showed up! Later we find out she was high as a kite on marijuana! So just saying that because it's not unreasonable to believe Z was going for his cell phone and not the gun. We'll never know though. And just saying that based on my personal experience above, maybe TM was overly aggressive due to marijuana?

EXCELLENT hypothesis and I totally agree that GZ gave TMI while recounting this part of his story. Fact is though no one is alive today that witnessed the initial start of the physical contact between GZ and TM. So we aint ever gonna know who did what first and it is aweful cuz I truly believe that point in the confrontation is the most important.
I have not seen any evidence to tell me TM had any sort of history with fighting but I have a boatload of nephews;babysat over 20 boys thruout my lifetime and have 3 grandsons..they (males) all fight IMO so I have to assume this was not TM's first one.

I got to address what you say about the pot because I happen to personally know how it affects you..I smoked it ALOT in my youth, and I know alot of others who smoke it now who have all different types of personalities..been around em while they are high on it countless times..real pot does NOT cause aggression at all..it is not a stimulant..one does not feel amped up or bulletproof after smoking it..in fact it does just the opposite.Pot may of been in this kids system but based on my own experience with this drug I do not believe for one second it played any role whatsoever in what happened that night.
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 12:40 pm



Trayvon Martin George Zimmerman Voice Id 2013

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73tPKeKddfE

(A comparison of Geoge Zimmerman's  voice samples yelling for help with the screams that were heard in the 911 call.)
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 12:43 pm

Zimmerman reenacts yells heard in 911 call

11:35AM EDT, October 16, 2012 – (01:43)

Compare Zimmerman's reenacted yells to the original yells heard in a 911 call.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/videogallery/70726402/News/Zimmerman-reenacts-yells-heard-in-911-call
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by auman58 on Mon Jul 08, 2013 12:47 pm

carlakay wrote:
I have not seen any evidence to tell me TM had any sort of history with fighting.......

Video of Trayvon Martin Hosting “Fight Clubs”, Photos of Guns, And Marijuana


http://www.mrconservative.com/2013/07/20441-video-of-trayvon-martin-hosting-fight-clubs-photos-of-guns-and-marijuana/
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 1:03 pm

auman58 wrote:
carlakay wrote:
I have not seen any evidence to tell me TM had any sort of history with fighting.......

Video of Trayvon Martin Hosting “Fight Clubs”, Photos of Guns, And Marijuana


http://www.mrconservative.com/2013/07/20441-video-of-trayvon-martin-hosting-fight-clubs-photos-of-guns-and-marijuana/

Trayvon Martin video: He recorded two homeless men fighting over a bicycle

June 3, 2013 | By Rene Stutzman, Orlando Sentinel

George Zimmerman's attorneys on Sunday released a statement, backtracking on what they say a video of a fight found on Trayvon Martin's cell phone shows.

In court Tuesday, defense attorney Mark O'Mara described it as Trayvon video-recording two friends beating up a homeless man.

But in Sunday's statement, O'Mara apologized and said it really shows Trayvon video-recording two homeless men fighting over a bicycle.

Trayvon, along with a friend, had come upon the fight and Trayvon had merely recorded it, according to the statement.

Read more:

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2013-06-03/news/os-trayvon-martin-fight-video-20130602_1_trayvon-martin-tuesday-o-mara-mark-o-mara


Last edited by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 1:46 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 1:43 pm

Witness: Doris Singleton - Sanford investigator

1:40 p.m.

O’Mara asks her if she was present when Investigator Serino met with Tracy Martin.

De la Rionda objects to hearsay. They approach for a sidebar.

1:38 p.m.

The defense calls Doris Singleton.

1:37 p.m.

The jury is seated. Judge Nelson checks to make sure they didn't research the case or see any reports about.

http://www.cfnews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2013/7/8/zimmerman_day_20.html
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by auman58 on Mon Jul 08, 2013 1:52 pm

Trayvon Martin Texts Reveal Fighting, Drug Use

http://abcnews.go.com/US/video/trayvon-martin-texts-reveal-fighting-drug-19249306

Probably homeless guys again.
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 1:59 pm

Witness: Doris Singleton - Sanford investigator

1:47 p.m.

O’Mara asks her for the setting of the meeting with Serino and Martin.

She says it was two days after the shooting and Martin was there to speak to Serino about concerns for the lack of an arrest.

De la Rionda objects. Judge Nelson says she can testify to what she observed but not what anyone else said.

Singleton says they were in a cubicle and a chair was brought over for Martin and his girlfriend.

She says it was two or three days after the incident. She says she was sitting diagonally to the cubicle about eight or ten feet from the desk.

She says Serino played the 911 call with the screams.

Martin was very upset and said and hung his head and cried, Singleton describes.

She says she gave a response to Serino.

O’Mara finishes questioning.

De la Rionda has no questions

Singleton is excused but subject to recall.

The defense calls Chris Serino.

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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 2:09 pm

Witness: Chris Serino - Sanford investigator

2:05 p.m.

Serino confirms he was the chief investigating officer.

He says he met with Tracy Martin and his girlfriend, Brandy Green, either the day or two days after the shooting.

Serino says Martin was concerned there was not an arrest.

He says they did a meeting in the police department conference room and later played the 911 recording for him at his desk.

He describes who was sitting where.

He says the focus was the audio portions. He says he played all the recordings for him.

Serino says the audio might’ve been played off of a CD and it was audible.

He says Martin’s response was emotional and he let him listen before he asked anything.

“I believe my words were ‘is that your son’s voice in the background,’” Serino says, not remembering the exact words.

Serino says he interpreted Martin’s response as a no.

He says Green was consoling Martin and didn’t ask her for a response.

Serino says a sergeant stopped in the area.

O’Mara finishes questioning.

De la Rionda asks about the sergeant.

Serino says he didn’t see Detective Singleton around.

He confirms it is a difficult thing to do to talk to someone about the death of a loved one.

2:00 p.m.

Sanford Police Department Investigator Chris Serino takes the stand.

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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by carlakay on Mon Jul 08, 2013 2:25 pm

auman58 wrote:Trayvon Martin Texts Reveal Fighting, Drug Use

http://abcnews.go.com/US/video/trayvon-martin-texts-reveal-fighting-drug-19249306

Probably homeless guys again.

as I have stated several times I do not watch speculation about this on the tv or read online much except what is shared here.. I also stated in a ciomment above that it is my opinion ALL males fight at some point in their lives. Don't believe I have ever said it was absolutely impossible TM started the altercation.

I also want to make it CRYSTAL clear that I do not believe anything TM may of texted or said to his friends AT ANY TIME is even relevent to what happened that night. In the same vein I do not believe anything GZ may of texted or posted online or said to any of his friends is relevant to what happened that night.
My interest in this case is based upon what happened that night between two human beings..I don't know nor ever have known either one of em so my opinions about them both are based upon my own knowledge of how people in general behave.
Also while I do not feel GZ's social networking history is relevent I do believe any criminal history he had is and I also feel his behaviour AFTER the shooting is relevant as well.
George Zimmerman was as adult Auman..Trayvon Martin was not but it is my opinion that if he was half the worthless hood some seem to believe he was then by 17 he should of already had a rap sheet.
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 2:29 pm

Witness: Chris Serino - Sanford investigator

2:15 p.m.

Serino says he doesn’t remember specifically telling Martin there would be a gunshot.

He agrees that Martin reacted appropriately to hearing the audio.

De la Rionda asks if Martin was having a hard time dealing with it.

“In my opinion, yes,” Serino says.

De la Rionda asks Serino if he prefaced the recordings that they would be difficult.

Serino says he believes he did.

Serino calls it a “very emotional moment.”

De la Rionda points out there was also a gunshot in the recording.

Serino says his judgment was to share all the information he had with Martin.

De al Rionda asks if there was any dispute that Martin understood that was the death of his son.

Serino confirms there was none.

He agrees he was trying to be sensitive.

Serino says Martin was looking away from him and the computer.

He says Martin’s response was under his breath, and he interpreted it as saying no.

De la Rionda asks if the no was directed at the audio just played or the identification of the voice.

O’Mara objects to speculation.

De la Rionda asks if Martin was hearing for the first time the death of his son.

Serino confirms it was before the audio was released.

De la Rionda asks about people's reactions to hearing about the death of a loved on.

Serino says they have extreme grief.

"It could be construed as denial," Serino says in answer to some people saying no.

De la Rionda finishes questioning.

O'Mara redirects.

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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 2:55 pm

Witness: Adam Pollock - Gym manager

2:41 p.m.

Pollock describes his athletic history and competitions.

Pollock describes mixed martial arts fighting. He says different disciplines can fall under the term.

Pollock says a “ground and pound” is mounting the opponent on the ground.

He says it requires some means of getting them on the ground and keeping them there while striking them from the top downward.

Pollock says the reason to do that is to control the opponent and potentially end the fight immediately.

O’Mara asks about the benefit of a first blow.

“On occasion those first blows end a fight,” Pollock says.

He describes the positioning of a “ground and pound” maneuver.

He says a mounted position would have their legs above the other person’s hips.

O’Mara asks Pollock to demonstrate the position.

O'Mara lays flat on the floor while Pollock demonstrates describing the availability of the person's hands to defend.

2:30 p.m.

Adam Pollock takes the stand. He owns Kokopelli's Gym and Fitness Center and is a trainer.

Witness: Doris Singleton - Sanford investigator

2:29 p.m.

Singleton says she overheard Serino ask Martin if he recognized the voice.

She says Martin was crying and wiping his face with tissues. She says Green was rubbing his shoulders.

Singleton doesn’t remember Green saying anything.

Singleton says she remembers Martin saying it wasn’t his son’s voice.

O’Mara finishes questioning.

De la Rionda cross examines.

She says Martin was crying while listening to the recording. She says she was choked up herself and felt horrible for him because she has children of her own.

She says to know he was hearing the sound that ended his son’s life made it tough to watch.

Singleton says she saw him wipe tears from his eyes and could see he was upset.

“I can’t imagine having to go through that because I have children. I couldn’t imagine,” she says.

O’Mara redirects.

He asks if there is any doubt Martin said it wasn’t his son.

She says there was no doubt he said that.

Singleton is excused, but subject to recall.

The defense calls Adam Polluck.

The attorneys enter a sidebar with Judge Nelson.

2:23 p.m.

Singleton retakes the stand. She points out the approximate distance in the courtroom with the help of O'Mara.

Witness: Chris Serino - Sanford investigator

2:23 p.m.

O’Mara asks if it was significant in the investigation that Martin didn’t identify the voice as his son.

Serino says it became significant in the investigation because it wasn’t in dispute at the time.

He says statements from initial responding officers, Tim Smith, and the statement of Jon Good supported it was Zimmerman yelling for help.

Serino says it was for his own clarification that the information he had was correct.

He says when Martin said no he thought he was answering the question about the voice being his son’s.

Serino says Martin never contacted him to listen to it again or change his mind.

Serino didn’t question Green. He says she didn’t counter or disagree with Martin.

Serino says there was no concern Martin didn’t understand the question.

De la Rionda re-cross examines.

He asks about the prior information Serino mentioned. De la Rionda points out that when he played the call for Zimmerman, he said it didn’t sound like him.

De la Rionda asks about Green consoling Martin.

Serino says he has never had the voice or sound of the shooting on a recording before.

He says the circumstances surrounding the incident are also emotional.

O’Mara redirects.

He asks about the statement Zimmerman saying it didn’t sound like him.

Serino says that is typical for someone hearing their voice on a recording. He says a lot of people don’t recognized their own voice.

“I didn’t take it as denial,” Serino says.

Serino is excused, but subject to recall.

The defense recalls Doris Singleton.

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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 2:58 pm

Witness: Adam Pollock - Gym manager

2:48 p.m.

Pollock says the position is powerful for the person on top, who also has gravity working for them.

O’Mara asks about the term “shrimping,” which is the attempt to maneuver away from the person on top.

Pollock says the benefit for the person on the bottom is moving to the guard position is having the hands and legs available.

Pollock says a trained person that gets someone on the bottom usually knows how to keep them there.

Pollock confirms he knows Zimmerman.

He says he met him in October 2010 when he went to the gym to lose weight and get in shape.

Pollock says the exercise regime started with grappling due to his availability. He says he picked classes based on his school and work schedule.

Grappling is like wrestling only the purpose is submission.

He says a move with grappling includes positioning moves like shrimping, side control, and submissions like chokes, arm locks and leg locks.

Pollock says grappling classes were offered four days a week and a normal training session was two hours long.

He says he supervised all of it. He says Zimmerman was a beginner and not accomplished in grappling.

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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 3:06 pm

Witness: Adam Pollock - Gym manager

3:01 p.m.

Pollock says Zimmerman was still learning to punch on the heavy bag.

He says Zimmerman lost a lot of weight and improved through the diet and exercise.

Pollock says Zimmerman had black eyes and looked emotionally traumatized after the shooting.

“Almost like a state of shock that was continuing,” Pollock says.

The state objects to a question about a conversation Zimmerman had about shrimping regarding the event.

The attorneys approach for a sidebar.

2:55 p.m.

Pollock says Zimmerman trained for about a year at the gym, but did put his membership on hold for some time.

Pollock says he did grappling and boxer training, and also used the facility on his own.

He says Zimmerman asked his account be on hold in November and December 2011.

He rated Zimmerman a “1” out of 1-10 and says it takes a tremendous amount of work. He says Zimmerman was diligent and approachable, but he didn’t have the history and background to create an athlete.

Pollock says the training starts with becoming proficient in their own body. He says Zimmerman started at .5.

He calls Zimmerman a hard worker, but says some people take time for development.

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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 3:11 pm

Witness: Adam Pollock - Gym manager

3:03 p.m.

O’Mara resumes questioning about Zimmerman’s athleticism.

Pollock says he would describe him as non-athletic.

Pollock says Zimmerman is physically soft, but he doesn't like using the terminology.

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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 3:16 pm

Witness: Adam Pollock - Gym manager

3:10 p.m.

O’Mara asks about the ways to end a fight and if screaming for help works.

Pollock says in a competive situation you can verbally tap out.

O’Mara finishes questioning.

Richard Mantei cross examines.

He asks about the phrase that the gym is the most complete fight gym in the world.

Pollock says other gyms have updated but he used to have the most equipment.

Mantei asks about Zimmerman taking a couple months off and if he knows if Zimmerman worked out somewhere else.

Pollock says he doesn’t know, but his facility is complete and is accessible.

Pollock says he would tell Zimmerman to come in for more training.

He says Zimmerman was between 250 and 260 pounds and would’ve lost 50 to 80 pounds.

Pollock says he didn’t do a body fat analysis for Zimmerman.

Mantei asks about the “first blow advantage.”

Pollock says he doesn’t teach strategy to beginners.

Mantei asks about grappling and if some things like cuts and scrapes can happen.

Mantei asks about the change of position maneuvers.

“A one minute round can seem like eternity if you’re not in condition for it,” Pollock says.

http://www.cfnews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2013/7/8/zimmerman_day_20.html
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 3:27 pm

Witness: Adam Pollock - Gym manager

3:20 p.m.

Mantei asks about the difficulty for the person on the bottom to strike upwards.

Pollock says grabbing someone’s arm isn’t practical and wouldn’t work.

He says if you’re on your back you can’t arm lock someone on top of you, but you would have to be extremely skilled, which he says Zimmerman is not.

Mantei asks about striking.

Pollock says the beginning will be about footwork, body posturing and then about the jab.

Mantei asks about positioning for the hands.

Pollock says it is taught.

He says Zimmerman went two or three times a week for grappling for a number of months, and then his schedule changed, so he went to boxing classes.

Mantei finishes questioning.

O’Mara redirects.

He asks if Zimmerman was proficient in what he was learning.

Pollock says no, but Zimmerman was doing well with the stretches and work.

Pollock says chokes and arm locks were not something Zimmerman could pull off.

O’Mara asks about the description of Zimmerman as soft.

Pollock says he lost a lot of weight but had a long way to go with more body fat to lose and muscle to gain. “He was by no means ready for being a competitive athlete,” Pollock says.

Pollock is excused.

The defense asks for a break. Court is in recess for 15 minutes.

http://www.cfnews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2013/7/8/zimmerman_day_20.html
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 3:51 pm

3:47 p.m.

The attorneys are in sidebar with Judge Nelson
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 3:53 pm

3:50 p.m.

The jury is reseated. The defense calls Tracy Martin.
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 4:10 pm

Witness: Tracy Martin - Trayvon Martin's father

4:09 p.m.

De la Rionda resumes questioning about Investigator Serino showing a photograph he used to identify Martin on the 27th.

De la Rionda asks about the meeting at the police station in the 28th where Serino played the 911 calls.

Martin says he doesn’t think Serino played each call in its entirety, leading up to the last call with the shot.

He confirms he was still in denial about his son being dead.

O’Mara objects. It is overruled.

De la Rionda asks him about his response of pulling his chair back and realizing it was the shot that killed his son.

Martin says his world was turned upside down at that point.

He confirms he attempted to answer Serino.

“Basically what I was listening to, I was listening to my son’s last cries for help. I was listening to his life being taken,” he says.

He confirms he was present at the mayor’s office when it was played again.

He can’t remember it was all of the 911 calls or just the last one.

He says he took control of the mouse and was able to rewind it over again.

De la Rionda asks if it brought him comfort hearing it again.

O’Mara objects.

De la Rionda asks if Martin was still dealing with the death while playing it over and over again.

“Yes,” Martin says.

He says he was just trying to figure out why the defendant got out of his vehicle and chased his son when he played the recording over and over again.

O'Mara re-directs.

He asks if he believes the police lied about him saying he said it wasn't his son's voice.

O'Mara asks if he instructed Crump to say the police lied.

He says he never instructed anyone to say anything.

O'Mara finishes questioning.

Martin is excused, but subject to recall.

The defense calls Chief Bill Lee to the stand.

4:01 p.m.

Martin says officers first wanted to verify his son’s identity with him.

O’Mara objects to a question about officers showing a picture of the body on the ground and asks to approach.

The attorneys enter a sidebar.

4:00 p.m.

Martin says mostly “yes” answers.

He says he doesn’t remember the exact words about not being asked to identify his son’s voice.

Martin says he told Serino he didn’t know and he pushed away from the table shaking his head and said he couldn’t tell, adding it was “something to that effect.”

Martin says he didn’t know Singleton was in the area.

He says he didn’t ask to hear it again at the moment.

Martin says he never told anyone he listened to a cleaned up version of the recording.

He says he didn’t tell Sybrina Fulton he had listened to the recording at Serino’s desk.

O’Mara asks about being at the mayor’s office when the tape was played for the whole family.

Martin says he didn’t advise anyone of what they were about to hear because they all know what they were there for.

He says after listening to it so many times, he said he knew it was Trayvon’s voice.

O’Mara finishes questioning.

De la Rionda cross examines.

He asks if it is still hard to believe his son is not living.

“It’s very difficult,” Martin says, calling him his best friend in life.

http://www.cfnews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2013/7/8/zimmerman_day_20.html


Last edited by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 4:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Mari 68 on Mon Jul 08, 2013 4:14 pm

I wonder if the jury is even giving a schitt about who is screaming on the audiotape?

I keep wondering why that would even make a huge difference. I've heard MOM state that if it was indeed Zimmerman than that makes him innocent.

I guess I just don't see it at all. It probably was Zimmerman. He was getting his ass kicked at the time.

I think GZ did approach TM and try to detain him - hence TM 'standing his ground'

I expect GZ to completely walk. I'm gonna hope some of the jurors speak to the media - before the riots, anyhow.


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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 4:14 pm

The defense calls Chief Lee to the stand.
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by carlakay on Mon Jul 08, 2013 4:17 pm

Mari 68 wrote:I wonder if the jury is even giving a schitt about who is screaming on the audiotape?

I keep wondering why that would even make a huge difference.  I've heard MOM state that if it was indeed Zimmerman than that makes him innocent.  

I guess I just don't see it at all.  It probably was Zimmerman.  He was getting his ass kicked at the time.

I think GZ did approach TM and try to detain him - hence TM 'standing his ground'

I expect GZ to completely walk.  I'm gonna hope some of the jurors speak to the media - before the riots, anyhow.



totally agree! All I been thinking this entire trial is how much I am missing the juror questions in this one. Gotta say tho if I were one on this case aint nooo way in the world I would speak to the media after the verdict..regardless what it is..
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by carlakay on Mon Jul 08, 2013 4:18 pm

Alessandra_Deux wrote:The defense calls Chief Lee to the stand.

FINALLY! cant wait to hear what this ones got to say.
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 4:21 pm

Sanford police chief fired in wake of Trayvon Martin case

By the CNN Wire Staff
updated 5:29 AM EDT, Thu June 21, 2012

http://www.cnn.com/2012/06/20/justice/florida-martin-case-police-chief
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 4:26 pm

carlakay wrote:
Alessandra_Deux wrote:The defense calls Chief Lee to the stand.

FINALLY! cant wait to hear what this ones got to say.


He said that he "retired" from the Sandford Police Department. Shocked
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 4:30 pm

Witness: Bill Lee - Former Sanford Police Chief

4:21 p.m.

He describes his law enforcement background. He says he was born and raised in Sanford.

He calls he was involved in the case as the chief of police.

O’Mara asks about the decision made to play the 911 call recording for the Martin family and the point forward.

Lee confirms he was aware the decision was made.

O’Mara asks about best practices for handling audio line-ups.

Lee says just like a photo line-up it would be shown individually so their decision is not influenced.

He says he understand the recording was played at the mayor’s office and law enforcement was not present.

Lee says he offered to be present, but it wasn’t accepted and he was excluded from the room.

De la Rionda begins cross examination.

Lee says he asked the city manager if could be present, but it was declined.

He says he was not in the mayor’s office when it was played.

De la Rionda asks more about line-ups.

http://www.cfnews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2013/7/8/zimmerman_day_20.html
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by carlakay on Mon Jul 08, 2013 4:37 pm

well goood grief..this poor jury..aint no way they can't see that there is a HUGE elephant in that courtroom after that extremely odd testimony.
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 4:47 pm

4:32 p.m.

Judge Nelson says six different matters are going to be taken up.

State has motion to strike Donnelly’s testimony. The state requests a Richardson hearing.

Another is regarding an animation and toxicology.

State has motion’s to strike Serino and Singleton’s testimony. Since Martin testified, the state no longer motion’s for that strike.

The state’s argument is the defense had prior knowledge Donnelly would identify Zimmerman’s voice on the 911 tape, but at his deposition he did not indicate he listened to the tape or had an opinion.

Mantei says there was an opportunity to communicate the information. He says they spent several hours together yesterday for a deposition.

Mantei says some people have said Donnelly was in the courtroom sometime last week, too.

Mantei says he has cases that show the prejudice.

Judge Nelson asks what the state would have done differently with the knowledge.

Mantei cites a case for the sort of things that could have been done with knowledge of the new information.

Witness: Bill Lee - Former Sanford Police Chief

4:28 p.m.

De la Rionda asks if a witness saying they heard the audio on TV would be tainted.

Lee confirms.

De la Rionda asks if that would be because they are influenced by the context.

Lee confirms.

He explains that a line-up would have six samples with some similar characteristics in for comparison.

De la Rionda finishes questioning.

O’Mara redirects.

He asks if the voice was still an issued being looked into in the investigation.

Lee says evidence and testimony gave indication as to whose voice it was.

O’Mara asks about the suggestion to go get six voices, but in the confines of this case, the best practice would have been to allow each person listen individually.

Lee says for investigative purposes, each person would’ve listened individually.

O’Mara asks if the city manager normally makes police decisions.

“No sir,” Lee says.

O’Mara finishes questioning.

Lee is excused.

Judge Nelson dismisses the jury for the evening, but the attorneys have matters to take up.

4:21 p.m.

He describes his law enforcement background. He says he was born and raised in Sanford.

He calls he was involved in the case as the chief of police.

O’Mara asks about the decision made to play the 911 call recording for the Martin family and the point forward.

Lee confirms he was aware the decision was made.

O’Mara asks about best practices for handling audio line-ups.

Lee says just like a photo line-up it would be shown individually so their decision is not influenced.

He says he understand the recording was played at the mayor’s office and law enforcement was not present.

Lee says he offered to be present, but it wasn’t accepted and he was excluded from the room.

De la Rionda begins cross examination.

Lee says he asked the city manager if could be present, but it was declined.

He says he was not in the mayor’s office when it was played.

De la Rionda asks more about line-ups.

http://www.cfnews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2013/7/8/zimmerman_day_20.html
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 4:52 pm

4:45 p.m.

O’Mara argues that it has to be material.

He says the state had an opportunity to play him the tape in the deposition, but they decided not to.

O’Mara says he finds it incredible to ask about this witness’s information when the court has been addressing other issues with the state.

He asks the state to show what they could’ve accomplished.

He calls the state’s cross examination of Donnelly quite good.

He says striking his testimony would be extreme.

Mantei responds saying there are two types of violations willful and inadvertent.

Mantei says it is a matter that would have reopened the deposition instead of trying to do it on the fly.

He says it created an impression before the jury.

Judge Nelson says she has the transcript from the deposition. She says the state had the opportunity to ask about his background.

She says she finds that defense should have and did not provide the information, but the state has not shown the prejudice to strike the testimony.

The next issue is the toxicology report.

4:38 p.m.

Mantei says if the information was communicated, they could have more thoroughly investigated the witnesses background rather than do it before the jury.

He says the foundation for his background could have been more fully explored.

They could have investigated if he was in court for the proceedings for the reason the decision to listen was on his own, Mantei says.

He says it was something Donnelly knew would assist the defense.

Judge Nelson asks if Donnelly had never listened to the tape and he listened to it in court, what would be the difference.

Mantei says that would be a risky scenario.

Judge Nelson confirms it would be for the defense. She says if he’s played the tape for the first time in the courtroom, what would change.

She asks if that would have happened what the state would have done differently.

She says the issue is he now listened to the tape, identified Zimmerman and the defense knew it, but what would the state have done differently.

Mantei cites a case.

He says in open court the opportunity would have come for the state to question him about instantly knowing who the voice was.

http://www.cfnews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2013/7/8/zimmerman_day_20.html
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Freckles on Mon Jul 08, 2013 5:13 pm

" Mantei says some people have said Donnelly was in the courtroom sometime last week, too."

" 4:28 p.m.

De la Rionda asks if a witness saying they heard the audio on TV would be tainted."

TRACY MARTIN ON STAND:


" 4:01 p.m.

Martin says officers first wanted to verify his son’s identity with him.

O’Mara objects to a question about officers showing a picture of the body on the ground and asks to approach.

The attorneys enter a sidebar.

4:00 p.m.

Martin says mostly “yes” answers.

He says he doesn’t remember the exact words about not being asked to identify his son’s voice.

Martin says he told Serino he didn’t know and he pushed away from the table shaking his head and said he couldn’t tell, adding it was “something to that effect.”

Martin says he didn’t know Singleton was in the area.

He says he didn’t ask to hear it again at the moment.

Martin says he never told anyone he listened to a cleaned up version of the recording.

He says he didn’t tell Sybrina Fulton he had listened to the recording at Serino’s desk.

O’Mara asks about being at the mayor’s office when the tape was played for the whole family.

Martin says he didn’t advise anyone of what they were about to hear because they all know what they were there for.

He says after listening to it so many times, he said he knew it was Trayvon’s voice.

O’Mara finishes questioning.

De la Rionda cross examines.

He asks if it is still hard to believe his son is not living.

“It’s very difficult,” Martin says, calling him his best friend in life."



http://www.cfnews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2013/7/8/zimmerman_day_20.html
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Freckles on Mon Jul 08, 2013 5:20 pm

Adam Pollock:The GYM

"He says Zimmerman went two or three times a week for grappling for a number of months, and then his schedule changed, so he went to boxing classes. ..."

" Pollock says chokes and arm locks were not something Zimmerman could pull off."

" 2:48 p.m.

Pollock says the position is powerful for the person on top, who also has gravity working for them.

O’Mara asks about the term “shrimping,” which is the attempt to maneuver away from the person on top.

Pollock says the benefit for the person on the bottom is moving to the guard position is having the hands and legs available.

Pollock says a trained person that gets someone on the bottom usually knows how to keep them there.

Pollock confirms he knows Zimmerman.

He says he met him in October 2010 when he went to the gym to lose weight and get in shape.

Pollock says the exercise regime started with grappling due to his availability. He says he picked classes based on his school and work schedule.

Grappling is like wrestling only the purpose is submission.

He says a move with grappling includes positioning moves like shrimping, side control, and submissions like chokes, arm locks and leg locks.

Pollock says grappling classes were offered four days a week and a normal training session was two hours long.

He says he supervised all of it. He says Zimmerman was a beginner and not accomplished in grappling."

GZ, taking classes for a year, is NOT an accomplished "grappler" BUT Trayvon Martin, NEVER taking grappling classes suddenly is accomplished? Trayvon has this magical ability over GZ? Huh?


http://www.cfnews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2013/7/8/zimmerman_day_20.html
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Mari 68 on Mon Jul 08, 2013 5:22 pm

George Zimmerman found Not Guilty!

New Black Panthers blow his head clean off!

What's your take gonna be on this development?

Mine?

Uhh, well it was all God's plan - who am I to question or second-guess....



LMAO
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Mari 68 on Mon Jul 08, 2013 5:23 pm

Freckles! Trayvon was a champion fighter!

All that marijuana really pumps someone up, too, don't forget.
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 5:26 pm

5:11 p.m.

Judge Nelson moves on to the animation.

O’Mara says the exhibit has some movement, but is still frames. Judge Nelson asks if there should be a Daubert hearing.

Mantei says the newest version of the evidence was given to him three hours ago.

Judge Nelson asks for the first witness for the Daubert hearing.

O’Mara asks for a recess.

Judge Nelson gives a 15 minute recess, but asks council to approach.

5:08 p.m.

Judge Nelson says she has already made a similar ruling in not allowing detectives to say their opinion.

She asks about a witness named Root who is a law enforcement expert.

O’Mara says his view of force events and reasonable abilities of the two parties and what element to consider. His expertise on use of force is another issue, plus the effects of trauma and officers involved in shootings.

He says there are a number of areas for Mr. Root to testify.

He says Root has seen the evidence and only spent a little time with Zimmerman and can give his testimony on that.

Judge Nelson asks if those are common sense decisions for the jury to make.

O’Mara says he doesn’t think this jury has the experience background.

Guy argues for the state that the motion is limited to the three opinions offered in his deposition, which was 2.5 hours long.

He says he can testify about law enforcement actions, but not about the defendant.

He says the opinions to the defendant’s guilt or innocence would be improper.

O’Mara asks Judge Nelson to review the deposition.

She says the state’s motion is very clear. She finds that allowing him to testify as an expert would be bolstering the defending. The motion in limiting is granted.

5:00 p.m.

West cites a case that has to do with the self-defense argument and admissibility of evidence.

Guy says the presence is not enough, but there has to be testimony about the effect, which they don’t have in this case.

He says it is unknown about the effects on Martin. He says the defendant’s comment that Martin appeared to be on drugs is among many comments said about him.

Guy says they are trying to backdoor negative character evidence.

Judge Nelson the defense has an expert that would testify about the effect it would have.

Guy says the court should hear it in a proffer to make a sound decision.

Judge Nelson asks if there would be an opportunity to proffer the witness.

she says not allowing the testimony to come in would be reversible error.

She says the state will have the opportunity to cross examine and call rebuttal witnesses. She denies the motion in limiting.

4:53 p.m.

West says the issue at this time is the amount of THC found in Martin’s toxicology.

Judge Nelson asks for a copy of it.

The state has a motion in limiting.

John Guy argues for the state that because the defendant didn’t know Martin and didn’t know his state and the minimal levels is unduly prejudicial.

He says the probative value is near zero and the prejudicial value is much greater.

Judge Nelson says she previously ruled it wouldn’t be in opening statements and they are now looking at the time of trial.

West argues the issue is specific to self-defense and the focus of the case. He says the knowledge of a positive level of THC and Dr. Bao changed his testimony.

He says Zimmerman said in his non-emergency call that Martin looked like he was on drugs. He says Martin looked like he was swaying in the 7-Eleven video and he was carrying a lighter.

He says they will have testimony from an expert that the level of THC is sufficient for some level of impairment and because of that and Zimmerman’s observations it is relevant and probative for the jury.

He says it supports the claim of self-defense because Martin’s behavior is also at issue and the level of his toxicology and how it impacted his behavior.

West says the state’s motion there was no knowledge Martin ingested it recently. He says Dr. Bao testified it would have been relatively recent.
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 5:36 pm



How Long Does Marijuana Stay in Your System?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=teuPYdt3zl8
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by carlakay on Mon Jul 08, 2013 5:40 pm

TM could of smoked a joint 6 weeks before being shot and that amount would of showed up in his system..anything smoked more recently..specificly that night.. and the amount of THC would of been alot more. Dr. Bao is an idiot.IMO
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Freckles on Mon Jul 08, 2013 5:41 pm

Mari 68 wrote:George Zimmerman found Not Guilty!

New Black Panthers blow his head clean off!

What's your take gonna be on this development?

Mine?

Uhh, well it was all God's plan - who am I to question or second-guess....



LMAO
Wry humor got your funny bone today, did it?
Happens to the best of us.
"God made me do it..." is the start of a brilliant confession cuz' we all know he isn't an angel.

Very Happy 

Felt like I was trapped in a bad remake of "To Kill a Mockingbird" but only in the sense of the courtroom....
hot and humid, and the flies drone on. So I was lulled into an afternoon nap. Just catching up now.
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Freckles on Mon Jul 08, 2013 5:42 pm

carlakay wrote:TM could of smoked a joint 6 weeks before being shot and that amount would of showed up in his system..anything smoked more recently..specificly that night.. and the amount of THC would of been alot more. Dr. Bao is an idiot.IMO
Contact high?
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 5:42 pm

5:35 p.m.

O’Mara says they are about 10 minutes away from having their witness present for the Daubert hearing.

Mantei says the number of blows being depicted in the exhibit has been removed and the objection no longer applies for that, but a number remain.

Judge Nelson asks if it would be helpful for the state to talk to the expert, Mr Shoemaker.

Mantei says he would be happy to do that.

Judge Nelson says she would like to take the issue up now.

Guy asks to substitute the timeline exhibit with a new fresh printed one.

Court is in recess until she is told they are ready.


http://www.cfnews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2013/7/8/zimmerman_day_20.html
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Alessandra_Deux

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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Alessandra_Deux on Mon Jul 08, 2013 5:45 pm

carlakay wrote:TM could of smoked a joint 6 weeks before being shot and that amount would of showed up in his system..anything smoked more recently..specificly that night.. and the amount of THC would of been alot more. Dr. Bao is an idiot.IMO

Dr. Bao opened the door for the defense to bring in the THC.

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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Mari 68 on Mon Jul 08, 2013 5:46 pm

If the judge lets that cartoon crap in, I say the riots will start tonight!


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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Freckles on Mon Jul 08, 2013 5:49 pm

Mari 68 wrote:Freckles!  Trayvon was a champion fighter!

All that marijuana really pumps someone up, too, don't forget.  
Marijuana would have given Trayvon the munchies.
He would NOT have walked out with just a tea and Skittles!
Not with forty dollars in the pocket and a case of muchies. Laughing 

Georgie, on the other hand...
he was just taking LIBRIUM and ADDERALL... two POWERFUL mood alters.
I just looked that smack up on the internet and it is some potent medication. Shocked 

IMO, I would rather deal with a mellowed out Trayvon who had the munchies
than a whacked out and unpredictable GZ who is carrying a loaded gun. At night. In the dark. In pursuit. Wannbe cop...
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

Post by Freckles on Mon Jul 08, 2013 5:50 pm

It is unproven theory by the dteam.
Only a theory but it could infect the jury.
The two teams need to work it out outside the camera, JMO.
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Re: George Zimmerman -- Trial for the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin --June 10, 2013

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